Mayor Goodman is recommending slot machines for "Neonopolis", an attraction in downtown in order to keep it alive. Some casinos are opposing as it was to complement the area and not compete. Have many of you visited "Neonopolis" and, if so, what were your opinions of it? I have never visited.

A complete article can be found in today's issue of the LVRJ.

Beth

Beth

I've never been there, nor do I have any great burning desire to see it. I've found better ways to spend my time in Las Vegas. :rolleyes:

When I visited, half of it wasn't open yet. But I have no desire to go back either. To many other places to eat & shop in Vegas to waste my time here. IMHO

I have visited it a couple of times and find the concept of it to be great for the downtown area. I think that maybe some of the Casinos should maybe give some free passes for the movie theater as maybe once people start to visit they will continue? Of course; I was sad to see the "Race Rock" (?) across the street close their doors. Maybe when the Canopy is extended the people will come more often?

I thought it was built with the idea of getting more locals to go downtown. No matter what the thought was behind it, locals attraction or tourist attraction, my opinion is that it's doomed to fail. I have no desire to go downtown to see a movie or shop at some sort of tourist attraction mall.

I have to side with the casino's about the slot machines. They're having enough problems without having to compete with a city sponsored attraction. Seems to me it sort of defeats the purpose of neonopolis, which I thought was to attract more people downtown so that they might visit the struggling downtown properties. By puttin in the slot machines, it sort of makes it the destination rather than the draw.

I also was there before everything was finished.
I could tell what shops and attractions were
going to be there. I never went back because nothing interested me. When I'm in Vegas I want to
do things I can't do at home. Shopping and movies
I do all year round. And putting slots machines
there just isn't enough for me to go back.

Sandy,

Like so many others, when I visited there wasn't much there and I had no desire to return. It is too slow to develop in a horrible location. But let's take it another step.

I think the biggest mistake with Neonopolis and Fremont Street including the FSE canopy is that the developers asked the wrong questions. They asked everybody, "What is wrong with downtown and what can we do to fix that problem"? The problems were reported to be dark side streets, seedy characters, smut, and panhandlers which made people afraid to walk the streets, especially at night. This being in the middle of the family boom of Las Vegas, the fixes were to brighten up the area, put public attractions on the streets to push the unwanted people away. One of the public attractions was a slow developing Neonopolis on the seediest end of the street.

Fact of the matter is that most of the undersireables were pushed about a half block away, a low resolution screen with absolutely no lasers was touted as being the newest laser light show in town, the beautiful neon of downtown was covered, and the second most popular road to drive on was shut off to car traffic. The only substance was a questionable light show that many have seen and nobody will tell their grandchildren about it.

The correct question that should have been asked is, "What would it take you to stay in one of the downtown hotels instead of the Flamingo, Caesars, Ballys, and Rio? I think the answers would have included the darker side streets and questionable people, and that could have been taken care of with lighting and security, which would be a relatively smaller investment. But I like to think that the question would have been answered with higher priority items such as finer dining, more attractive swimming pool areas, easier access from the airport, better smoke ventilation in the casinos, better secure parking, big name shows, and update the hotels with better rooms, elevators, and checkin area.

I think if they could have established a place that people wanted to stay, they could have moved forward to a Neonopolis type development with some success.

JMT:
I agree.

Susan

JMT: I must disagree with you on 90% of your statements...Here's why...
We at one time stayed out on the strip! We have stayed now downtown for the last +/- 12 years,three to four times a year, way before the canopy was built...
I am not sure as to where you read about the "Fremont Street Experience" not very popular?
Everything I see on it has good reviews!!
I see crowds of people every show whenever we are in town (just returned) and the people seem to Ohh! and Ahh! and walk away with good vibes?? I have three sets of relatives that have lived in "Las Vegas" for over twenty years and they and their local friends seem to have good things to say about it??
The police on bikes keep the area as secure as can be, at least within a few blocks of the canopy!..The other (east) side of LV Blvd may be a different story later at night?
When we visit the strip we are continually accosted by Porno pushers, Time share freaks, and when alone I have been propositioned by several prostitutes at several of the high class stip Casino/Hotels.
As to the Locals going to the movies there; I don't know? Parking may be a problem for them?
This is just my opinion; I have not ever felt not safe anywhere in "Las Vegas"!! Like any larger city; cover your ass and be careful where ever you are. Every city has rougher areas..

I agree and disagree too<g>. I only take in FSE once every year or two, so the novelty hasn't worn off for me.

I've never understood exactly the purpose of Neonopolis ... was it intended as a place for local teens to hang out or a place for tourists to park their teens. Either way, I don't think it's a great location!

As for the safety around Fremont Street ... well, I used to walk down just one short block to the Lady Luck, but I stopped wandering even that one block after some I ran into some rather unsavory panhandlers, with no security in sight. About the only place I walk off Fremont Street is the short block from the back door of the Vegas Club down to MSS ...and I only do that because I'm within sight of the MSS valet parking attendants.

I've stayed in a few hotels downtown (Lady Luck, MSS, Golden Nugget and California), and I've thought about trying the Fitz or Four Queens, but I keep getting better offers for better rooms elsewhere. The Golden Nugget is extremely nice, but it's hard for a sunfish like me to get a decent offer. It's not like I need a fancy room; I'm not the type to lounge around the room<g>, but none of the others have the "hook" to make me want to stay there.

It's okay to disagree with me. No problem. I have stayed downtown as much as anyone I know, both pre FSE and post FSE. And I completely agree with most of your statements and disagree on only 2 issues. I think there is plenty of bad press and poor reviews of FSE and I disagree with your security evaluation.

If you like FSE, that's fine. If you really want to see something less than good reviews, read the Las Vegas Review Journal. You will find constant redesign, redfinition, and refinancing problems. You'll find cancelled shows, fueds, lawsuits, and money problems since day one. From the tourist side, the hotel occupancy tells the story. Sure, you will hear ooohs and aaahs as the lights go down and the show starts, and applause after the show. You will also see a mass evacuation to leave downtown after the show is over. Ditto for any 6 minute wonder in Vegas. Crowds show up, ooh and ahh, see the show, applaud, then leave the area. The key difference in my opinion is that when the crowds disperse from the pirate show at Treasure Island, they don't hop in their cars and drive to Sams Town in large numbers. They continue to visit the strip properties.

It's okay to like downtown and it's okay to stay there. I think that you would be doing a terrible disservice to a first time visitor if you were to claim that the police on bikes keep the area as secure as can be within a few blocks of the canopy. (and I assume you mean north and south) I would not advise going south of the canopy at night unless you have business in the Golden Nugget garage. I would only go north for California, MSS, Lady Luck and Binions garages, and only in direct paths. I don't suggest random venturing 3 blocks away from the canopy...north or south. Furthermore, I think the areas that I feel comfortable in today are the exact same areas that I felt comfortable in in the pre FSE days.

I agree with your views of the strip, although I've never noticed the time share soliciters to be freaks.

Beth - This is a great topic! I think it's good to hear everyone's opinions on it - whether we all agree or disagree. Let me give you my 2 cents:

I am a lover of neon and actually have 3 pieces of neon in my home. When I heard Neonopolis was opening, I was very excited.

Since it has opened, I have visited it 3 or 4 times. On the first visit, not everything was open so I suspended my opinion at that time. But on subsequent visits, most everything was open and I have to admit it's somewhat of a disappointment.

On the plus side, it's really great to see all the refurbished old neon signs. It really gives one a sense of nostalgia and the "old" Las Vegas. If anyone I know loves neon, I always highly recommend a visit to Neonopolis. For the neon lover, it's certainly something to see.

On the negative side, two things:
#1 - the shops surrounding Neonopolis are mostly junk stores and not anything to recommend to anyone. There's nothing there that is unique and nothing that would make me want to shop there. Other than buying an ice cream cone at Dairy Queen, I never spent another dime there.
#2 - there are still too many seedy people hanging around that area and I never feel completely safe. There are several neons that have been placed a block one way or another from Fremont Street and upon seeing them, I wanted to get a closer look. But as I moved closer, all sorts of undesirables emerged from the shadows and I found myself very uncomfortable. I agree with JMT that the side streets are too dark and there doesn't appear to be enough security.

On my last two trips downtown, I parked at MSS (because it's convenient to park there and I stopped to to gamble for a while there too) and walked over to Fremont Street. The walk from MSS to Freemont Street is a bit scary and not one that I necessarily enjoy. I certainly watched my back when I did it. I certainly would not have subjected my parents to such a walk if I brought them downtown on my last trip.

I guess the bottom line is that downtown still has too many seedy people around and security doesn't seem to be enough. It still needs to be cleaned up. JM2C.

Mike

The biggest plus to me is that Las Vegas thrives on adversity. Las Vegas loves a challenge. Tell them it can't be done and they will do it. History shows that many popular attractions were initial failures. History shows that Las Vegas should have been a ghost town many times if it ever became a town. History shows us that Las Vegas does not mind tearing down classic history to make way for the future.

I'm not impressed with the FSE light show. I suspect that the new LED lights to make the screen a much higher resolution will make the canopy become an advertising venue as FSE digs for money. Even if Neonopolis becomes profitable, which I doubt, I don't see it as a major attraction. What I am excitied about is what will happen to downtown in the long term. I think that beyond the canopy and beyond Neonopolis is something exciting. I think it might be something that we couldn't imagine. It might have something to do with the land behind the Plaza. It might make use of the land between Fremont Street north to the freeway. Who knows?

JMT and all,
I like the downtown area. I feel it has a differnt feel then the strip, dealers are more freindlier and a small tip is more valued here then on the strip or even the locals places. I can say, I've had some times downtown where, I don't think my life was in danger, but I have felt uncomfortable many times. This isn't just in the side streets, it's in some of the casino's. On our last trip in November, my wife was scared by a man waiting outside the restroom of the Las vegas Club. I have had 'odd' feelings at times just walking under the canopy at night too.
I think the rule here is, remember where you are at, at all times. Just because your on vacation, don't let down your gaurd. It's one of the reasons we've taken to only drink heavely where we stay. Knowing security in your hotel has it's advantages too. One of the resons I have come to like smaller hotels.
Downtown has a lot of these to choose from ranging in all buget sizes.
My only question I have is, what is hotel capisity of down town to casino square footage compared to the strip? With the drinking & driving laws the way they are today, even at home I stay close to where I live. (The cab ride is cheaper) I often wonder if something should be done to shuttle people from the strip for free. Make an agressive play for that market. Also the draw of a new hotel or 2 sure wouldn't hurt downtown. Remodel all you want, but a new place is a proven winner in the people draw department.
M2C